Would you ever work under a Hmong woman leaderhsip in a company?

mmm0403

sarNie Juvenile
I have heard so much bad things about Hmong women when they got to be a supervisor position. They would treat other Hmong women like shits, but wouldn't dare to treat others the same. Two Hmong women at my aunts' work places treated them (all Hmong women) like shits, just because they think they are better, but they did not do the same to the Mexican women. The Hmong supervisor woman at my aunt's (aunt #1) work, was so cruel to her, and other Hmong women, some actually ended up leaving. It got to the point that her son actually went there to have a talk with the manager to do something about the cruel Hmong supervisor's treatment. She was even more cruel and hateful after that. This time, she cut off some of my aunt's hours. Man...at first I thought she was white, but when I heard that she was actually a Hmong woman, I got so pissed.

Another Hmong woman who got to be a supervisor at my other aunt's (aunt 2) company treated the Hmong women the same bad treatment, while she treated the Mexican women nice. She (the evil Hmong supervior) made the Hmong workers do the heavy work and kept making them do without rest, while she let the Mexican women rests often and do the light work.

Man...what's going on these Hmong women's head? Hmong against Hmong?

This is one of the reasons I don't want to make Hmong women leaders.
 

danger

sarNie Hatchling
That is the reason why I don't like the idea of having a woman President. Women tends to abuse their power and look down on others when having too much power. This doesn't apply to every women but the majority. I don't understand why Hmong people keeps on doing that to their own kind.

There's a Hmong guy that works for Sprint in Wisconsin. My aunt was charged on her bill for internet, which she doesn't even want and don't even know how to use. She called Sprint and told them to take it off, but kept being charged for it month after month. She got tired of them ripping her off, so she decided to go to a Sprint local store and talk to some of the workers there, which was a Hmong guy. My aunt explained how she did not even prescribed for internet or even know how to use it and they kept charging her for it bill after bill. The Hmong guy kept saying that my aunt has used it and that's why she is charged for it and for her to pay for it because she wouldn't have been charged for it unless she has used it.

My aunt asked him how does he know that she has used it and have he seen her used it. He couldn't answer and just told an American lady to talk to my aunt. The white lady then waived the charge and cancel the internet service on the account.

Hmong people needs to stop hating and treating their own kind like this. That is why we have no country and we're always killing our own kind.
 

pink_juliet_kashie

sarNie Oldmaid
whoo! whoo! whoo! slow down there girls...i tink tat those hmong women are just as bad as the hmong guys but we just don't tend to realize it because usuallie see the man in power...so wen the woman is in power and something goes wrong...we seem to see her fault more clearly...i think as woman we need to support each other..i'm not anti-man..but i tink men been in charge for long enough...women need to be level with the men..and how can we achieve tis wen we women ourselves dont' support our sex...esp wen the majority of men alreadie oppose to it...

as the for a woman president..i dun tink we're ready for one yet..but i'm not saying that women don't qualify...take Hilary Cilton for example..i bet the majority if not all the presidental decisions Bill Clinton made wen he was a president had influences from his wife...in fact looking back into histories the presidents gain much respect and aid from their wives...and i support Hilary because if she does become president we can alwaise be asured tat her husband will alwaise help her out....because he has been a president himself...and a prettie good darn one too if you ask my opinion...

and about the hmong tingie..well i guess you just ran into some coconuts/ white-wash hmongs..which isn't hard to find these dayz...i happen to know lotx of dedicated and supportive hmong workers...and i cant' stand the fact the people claim tis and tat about the leaders of the hmong community...that the money they make from new years / water festivals..etc. goes into their own pockets...and they cheat for the miss. pagents...crap...maybe at some point it may seem likely...but there's been no proff..juz rumors and gossips...it's like come back and tell me about it wen you have proof

but i like tat one hmong phrase about hmong women..which i tink is true..tat Hmong men are afraid of smart women....

it's sad...just to talk about we hmong people..we are soo unsupportive of our own kind..we cannot stand a person of our own level raising to become a leader...i alwaise hear ppl yapping about "him?! no wayy...if he can become a leader than by now i'm this and that"..it is very depressing...and even at events like talent shows / new year...no matter how good some one is on stage...there will alwaise be ppl saying...wat is she/ he doing..tat's soo gay..i can do so much better..i dunno..i'll stop here...i'm just going to upset myself and tis might get a bit controversal...so
 

danger

sarNie Hatchling
First off I'm not a girl. :eek: I'm not looking down on the women but I'm just talking about majority here. Women tends to abuse their powers and rights. If you really think about it, it's very true. Not that guys dont' do it, but not as much as the ladies. Also, things are never equal so we just have to live with it and I believe that women should never have the same power as the guys do. I know this will sound kind of rude and offend the ladies, but got to say it.

Hmong men are afraid of intelligent women because they tend to take advantage over the guys. They usually don't listen to their husbands and always do things their way and they think they know it all. Ladies you can't deny this. :lol: Not all intelligent women are like this, but most of them are. When you are better than someone at a sport, you will become cocky.
 

mmm0403

sarNie Juvenile
I'm a woman, and I think woman are evil. Men are violent, but they are not as evil as women. Women tend to talk bad about women, look down on women, talk bad behind their back, like to spread bad rumors about other women.
 

pink_juliet_kashie

sarNie Oldmaid
i'm sorrie for messing up u're sex...danger..juz tat the majority of us here are gals...

a lot of hmong guys say intelligent women don't listen to them..i dun tink so..it's just tat the women question...and argue for what they tink is rite.....but you know the older generation of women..rather it's rite or wrong what there husbands are doing they most of the time join with the husband or just let it brush off...so the hmong guys are juz use to being in power 24/7 and wen the woman rebel a little..oh they tink they know it all...talk about abusing your powers...an example of tis...the older generation if their hubbies are cheating on them...wahh..it's okay..other ppl have 2-3 wives too...it's okay my husband can disrespects me he's my husband..he's my god...but if you look at tis generation of more independent...intelligent women...no they're not going to stand this..tat's why the number of hmong divorces have gone up..and i tink tis is the best way out of it...

women dun abuse their powers more than men does..if not the same...surely not more...no statiscs..everyone takes advantage wen they are in power..

may i ask why women "should never" be at the same level as men? i know tat rite not it doesn't seem like tat'll ever happen...but hey! doesn't mean we can't try...we're slowly progressing..

LOL..new test proves tat men gossips as much as women does..they juz don't realize it's gossip...the little "office talks" yeah! they're consider gossip...and please like men don't bad mouth other ppl...I know women are evil indeed...who's not...men are as well...u can't deny there's not at devil inside of you...it's true wat u say..men are violent tat's why the mass majorit of crimials/ muderers / terriosts are men....i tink bad mouthing and being violent is far from each other...
 

lady_sati

sarNie Adult
sorry that you have to see that.

but.... i mean, not all hmong women are like that.
i understand that the more older generation dont know much
about TEAM WORK, and WORK ETHICS versus personal feelings, etc.

but... i was thinking about senator mee moua,
she's a hmong women and i think that if other
hmong women see her power and her abilities,
im sure things will change for the better.

i think im off topic.

i think what mmm0403 mentioned about evil women,
i can understand that, but i think for hmong women,
it's more of jealousy and insecurity.

yah, you're gonna shiot talk that girl cause you're scared
she's gonna take your man, or you're scared or not secure
enough to know if she'll be a treat to you.

but anyways.
go people!!! right?

take care ya'll.
 

danger

sarNie Hatchling
I think a lot of divorces today are due to the intelligence of women but the abuse of their rights and powers. They know that in America you can divorce your husband anytime anyday and wouldn't be a problem. The husband cannot say a thing because when the paper comes, you just got to sign it. I can understand if there was a reason for divorcing, but many of the divorces today are for the dumbest reasons. Hmong women nowadays tends to cheat a lot on their husbands, not that the guys don't but women does it more. When the guys say something, it's divorce time. The ladies are also always calling the cops on the guys all the time whenever there's an arguement. Come on girls, tell the truth. :D The majority of the Hmong women these days are abusing their rights and powers.

Guys do gossip because we're all humans. It's natural and fun. :lol: Men abuse their powers, but they tend to know when to stop, but the ladies just kept going and going like crazy. Trust me I know. I mean there's a lot of intelligent women out there and I really respect them for what they're doing, and I believe more women should follow their examples.
 

tavang

sarNie Juvenile
this is what hmong people always do. they don't want to help their people out. they only help other people and not their own kind. this is just messed up.
 

tearsofautumn

sarNie Hatchling
Hm, I think that sometimes Hmong woman or any Hmong person who is in charge or get the higher position tend to forget about the other Hmong people. Since Hmong people are not that much in higher power at the work place that when they do get a bit of the power they take it too far or really personal. They drill down so tough and hard that other Hmong workers develope a hate towards them which would lead to bring them down and striping away any power they have. So, thats why working for other Hmong person who is in charge doesn't fit well because of misunderstanding and misused of power.

It's hard working for anybody, but it's harder if you guys dont have a good communication and understanding of each other. I just got promoted to a higher position at my company and i realize how hard it is to be in charge....it's not all about the money or the power, but the people who stand by you as a team.
 

mly

sarNie Hatchling
Well...I think I gotta stick up to the two Hmong women who made it to be supervisor. Come on, listen to what you guys are saying. They treat the Hmong women bad but treat the Mexican women good. If I'm correct, us Hmong cannot wait for another Hmong to have power so they can "go easy on us." But really, in the real world, it's a dog eat dog world. If you want a higher pay, you can't let culture/family get in your way. If you do, there's no point being a supervisor. Because if you only help your ppl, the other race will report you too. Hmong ppl tu tu siab very quick. A couple of years ago, I read somewhere that some Hmong ppl in MN was not going to support Sen. Mee Moua. Why? Because they say that when they invite her to their parties, she's always busy. That is so stupid! It'a not the supervisor abusing their position, it's us Hmong ppl who expects to be treated better then the other race when another Hmong is in charge. And you know what? It don't work like that. Let's say you own a business and your employees are all Hmong. You want them to get good production, but they slack off bad. And you know that if you say something they will tu siab at you, but at the same time, your business is not doing so well. What will you do as a boss/supervisor? Maybe those two supervisors are mean but if you look at it, other race supervisor are like that too. Is it because they are Hmong and since they are not going easy on their own ppl makes them bad? But it's okay for a Meskas supervisor to be mean to us and we come home and complain about it but says, "I'm just doing it for the job so kav liam." But when it comes to another Hmong, NO! report them to the plant manager??? You see what's wrong there? I do! It's very sad to see that Hmong ppl wants to take advantage of each other.
 

mmm0403

sarNie Juvenile
Well...I think I gotta stick up to the two Hmong women who made it to be supervisor. Come on, listen to what you guys are saying. They treat the Hmong women bad but treat the Mexican women good. If I'm correct, us Hmong cannot wait for another Hmong to have power so they can "go easy on us." But really, in the real world, it's a dog eat dog world. If you want a higher pay, you can't let culture/family get in your way. If you do, there's no point being a supervisor. Because if you only help your ppl, the other race will report you too. Hmong ppl tu tu siab very quick. A couple of years ago, I read somewhere that some Hmong ppl in MN was not going to support Sen. Mee Moua. Why? Because they say that when they invite her to their parties, she's always busy. That is so stupid! It'a not the supervisor abusing their position, it's us Hmong ppl who expects to be treated better then the other race when another Hmong is in charge. And you know what? It don't work like that. Let's say you own a business and your employees are all Hmong. You want them to get good production, but they slack off bad. And you know that if you say something they will tu siab at you, but at the same time, your business is not doing so well. What will you do as a boss/supervisor? Maybe those two supervisors are mean but if you look at it, other race supervisor are like that too. Is it because they are Hmong and since they are not going easy on their own ppl makes them bad? But it's okay for a Meskas supervisor to be mean to us and we come home and complain about it but says, "I'm just doing it for the job so kav liam." But when it comes to another Hmong, NO! report them to the plant manager??? You see what's wrong there? I do! It's very sad to see that Hmong ppl wants to take advantage of each other.

When it comes to women like Mee Moua, that's another story. Mee Moua is a well educated woman. She knows what's right and wrong. It's too much to expect more from her because she is Hmong, but my stories, I was referring to those work places where those non educated Hmong women work. The Hmong women who are able to speak some English think they are too good and look down on those know less or those Hmong women that got promoted to a higher position think that they are too good. I don't know how well your mom's English is. If she works one of those places and got treated like that, you would be pissed. Those women I was talking about, they never asked for better treatment, only equal treatment, isn't that too unfair? A lot of Hmong people expect a lot from Mee Moua, because she is Hmong. She can understand Hmong culture, and it's easier to communicate with her. A lot of Hmong elders don't speak English and don't understand or like American laws and cultures, I think that's why they want a Hmong representative, like Mee Moua.
I think Mee Moua knows what to expect of her as a leader from the Hmong community. If Mee Moua is going to talk to the Hmong community the same as the White leaders, what's the point for Hmong elders voting for her or other Hmong people? A lot of Hmong elders want and need someone who is Hmong, knows Hmong people, Hmong language, Hmong culture, Hmong values, etc..., right? I know, sometimes, these elders don't understand Mee Moua's role, but Mee Moua is intelligent, she knows what she can do and what she cannot do. That's all my thoughts for now...
 

pink_juliet_kashie

sarNie Oldmaid
of course..if anyone treats your mother bad of course you'll be pissed...who wouldn't be...unless you're an ungrateful lilo brat...but tat doesn't mean you have to be bias/ prejudice againste EVERY single hmong women...or african american or mexican tat comes your way...let's not talk about being unfair...i tink generalizing the WHOLE is unfair...

and i tink tat is very true about the tu siab part...i have a Hmong teacher..and she can't control the hmong class i'm in because of the same ting...but wen she starts sending ppl out to their conselors, the Hmong students are the ones tat hate her the most...**shake head** even more than the mexicans / white / african americans she sent out b4...
 

pink_juliet_kashie

sarNie Oldmaid
I think a lot of divorces today are due to the intelligence of women but the abuse of their rights and powers. They know that in America you can divorce your husband anytime anyday and wouldn't be a problem. The husband cannot say a thing because when the paper comes, you just got to sign it. I can understand if there was a reason for divorcing, but many of the divorces today are for the dumbest reasons. Hmong women nowadays tends to cheat a lot on their husbands, not that the guys don't but women does it more. When the guys say something, it's divorce time. The ladies are also always calling the cops on the guys all the time whenever there's an arguement. Come on girls, tell the truth. :D The majority of the Hmong women these days are abusing their rights and powers.

Guys do gossip because we're all humans. It's natural and fun. :lol: Men abuse their powers, but they tend to know when to stop, but the ladies just kept going and going like crazy. Trust me I know. I mean there's a lot of intelligent women out there and I really respect them for what they're doing, and I believe more women should follow their examples.
talk about abusing your powers..yes Hmong women knows the law is on their side now..i'm not the stating that they're angels...but you are here stating tat women abuse their powers way more than men does..not true...wat about mens...they know they can marrie a 2nd wife...3rd wife...4th wife...and their wife probably won't do a ting about it..because as hmongs...all we care about is our face...oh! if you're divorce once you can NEVER find another husband...and since the women's relatives probably do the same ting the men know their relatives can't say crap...so they ABUSE their power and juz carrie on doing so...marring the whole women population if they can..

and i dun tink hmong womens don't cheat A LOT on their husband..just more than there use to be...but when compare to men...it's noting...tat cops ting is soo not true..they're not alwaise calling the cops...i tink u're exaggerting it a bit...and even if they do...if the men are pure angels then they have noting to be afriad of...correct? and i dun think the cops are stupid enough to believe a women who juz says he beat me up...of course they'll do investigations to see if he did lay his hands on her and is enough to throw him in jails

of course i know hmong women abuse their powers now a dayz...but liked i've stated i neva said they were complete angels...but it wuz stated in this thread tat they abuse the power WAY more then men..i'm highly disgreeing....

wat do you mean by they keep going like crazie..and men know wen to stop..may i get an example...maybe examples to back up ur assumptions may be more convincing...

i tink most hmong guys these days are just angry because hmong womans are now no longer in their complete control...
 

danger

sarNie Hatchling
talk about abusing your powers..yes Hmong women knows the law is on their side now..i'm not the stating that they're angels...but you are here stating tat women abuse their powers way more than men does..not true...wat about mens...they know they can marrie a 2nd wife...3rd wife...4th wife...and their wife probably won't do a ting about it..because as hmongs...all we care about is our face...oh! if you're divorce once you can NEVER find another husband...and since the women's relatives probably do the same ting the men know their relatives can't say crap...so they ABUSE their power and juz carrie on doing so...marring the whole women population if they can..

and i dun tink hmong womens don't cheat A LOT on their husband..just more than there use to be...but when compare to men...it's noting...tat cops ting is soo not true..they're not alwaise calling the cops...i tink u're exaggerting it a bit...and even if they do...if the men are pure angels then they have noting to be afriad of...correct? and i dun think the cops are stupid enough to believe a women who juz says he beat me up...of course they'll do investigations to see if he did lay his hands on her and is enough to throw him in jails

of course i know hmong women abuse their powers now a dayz...but liked i've stated i neva said they were complete angels...but it wuz stated in this thread tat they abuse the power WAY more then men..i'm highly disgreeing....

wat do you mean by they keep going like crazie..and men know wen to stop..may i get an example...maybe examples to back up ur assumptions may be more convincing...

i tink most hmong guys these days are just angry because hmong womans are now no longer in their complete control...
The idea of marrying many wives, I can't deny that that isn't abusing their power. But, have you ever thought of how it even happened and why did men out of no where start marry multiple wives? People just take what they saw and start doing it for no reasons, just like what the Hmong men are doing nowadays, marrying multiple wives. I believe there has to be a logical reason as to why, not for their satisfaction.

If you do not believe that women abuse their powers more than men, I suggest you look very closely. Also, try to look it from the men's perspective and not just the women and you will see. About the women calling the cops on the guys all the time, it is very true. I used to think it was just Hmong people exaggerating, but it really happens. They will use every little excuse they can find to call the cops on the guys whenever there's an arguement. And you know who the cops will side with? The ladies, because they're so innocent and know how to put up a good show. :rolleyes: But since most of the times the guys never touched the lady, the cops can't do anything but go back. The point here is that they need to show respect to their husbands instead of always trying to walk over them because they think they are more intelligent than the guys and they know that men are not allow to hit women or do anything to them in this country. I'm not trying to say that men should be allow to hit women, but there are better solutions than to always call the cops on their husband. To me, that's like divorcing your husband or treating them like trash where you can throw it out whenever you want.

Another thing Hmong women forget is who they are. They need to understand who they really are and stop denying their cultural beliefs just because we're living in a new country. By the way I'm not saying this because I'm a guy, but from what I am seeing nowadays in today's society involving our Hmong people. B)
 

pink_juliet_kashie

sarNie Oldmaid
yes..true we need to keep our culture belief..but understand we are living in a new country...if you don't adapt to a certain point...you'll never make it here...hmong women aren't forgetting who they are...they're juz not in their husband's COMPLETE control anymore...and of course we can see clearly tat hmong men are not forgetting who they are...marring this young girl..that young girl..just like it was in the old days..you have to move on with time...whether you consider tat throwing you culture belief away or not...

the majority of second wives are for satisfaction...i know plenty....it's to make the oldie feel like they're young again...and cuz they know they can...and then they wait for the tiniest lilo problem for an excuse to throw out the first wife or to marrie the second wife

i tink you are the one who has to see it from the women's perspective...feel what the hmong women have to endure what they have to face..in the past century...first they're not allow to go to school...they have no say wat so ever...if thier husband marries a 2nd wife she has to share him w/ her...i know guys would rather sucide then share their wife...if they're marrie and goes out somewhere like to a friend's house without the husband's consent she's talked about all over town..if the men is marrie and goes out...mess around with girl..oh! it's natural..now put urself in our shoes...how would you feel...you tink guys are abusing they're powers less then the women...

the cop ting..not women dun call for every tiny bit...of problem...if they're husband's not about to kill them i dun tink they'll call...cuz if they do call and nothing happened then they'll be the one in trouble w/ the poilice...trust me the husband probably did some threatenning and as we all know threating someone is against the law here in the US....and liked i stated b4..if you haven't done crap then why worrie...let the police come...let them check..their not tat stupid...hmong ppl esp. guys seem to distrust the cops extremly..but their not stupid...

no..i tink the point here is tat the men need to realize that they can no longer step all over our faces..and no longer throw us out like yesterday's leftover and get a new meal...because we're raisen...and if you don't show us respect us then don't expect the same from us..because why should you show respect to a person who doesn't show any towards you..and if you treat us like trash then consider yourself trash to us as well...i tink it's as simple as tat...what you give should be wat you get...

am i'm stating this because I am a woman..and i know we women don't abuse our powers more than men...maybe equal..maybe less...but not more..i live w/ a mass popularity of hmong ppl...and since we "gossip" soo much..be sure tat i hear lotx of stories...
 

candi

sarNie Juvenile
I need to hear the hmong supervisor's side of the story too. Sometimes, the employees tend to take advantage of the situation when they know their supervisor is Hmong.

This may not relate to this topic, but when I take my hmong class, some of the students dont care to come on time because the instructor is hmong. Some of them even talk on their phone in class too. If it was an American instructor, they wouldnt dare come late or talk on the phone.
 

angelness

sarNie Egg
First off I'm not a girl. :eek: I'm not looking down on the women but I'm just talking about majority here. Women tends to abuse their powers and rights. If you really think about it, it's very true. Not that guys dont' do it, but not as much as the ladies. Also, things are never equal so we just have to live with it and I believe that women should never have the same power as the guys do. I know this will sound kind of rude and offend the ladies, but got to say it.

Hmong men are afraid of intelligent women because they tend to take advantage over the guys. They usually don't listen to their husbands and always do things their way and they think they know it all. Ladies you can't deny this. :lol: Not all intelligent women are like this, but most of them are. When you are better than someone at a sport, you will become cocky.
Wow dude... something must be wrong with you... whose the one getting three wives here?? not the women, I'm for sure. Don't start bad-mouthing women now... you came from one.... I'm a Hmong women and that's just plain offensive to me... you should know that sometimes, most women do try to work twice as hard to be as equal to a man... perhaps not mentally, but physically and economically... I've never taken advantage of any guy I've been with... Perhaps the people you're around are hard-headed and narrow-minded but don't start applying it to hmong women in general... I find it 'Shocking' when you say guys DON"T WANT intelligent women!? Honestly, those kind of guys got some serious problems then...I swear... I believe a guy should fall in love with a womens mind... not someplace else... Now that's just freaky...
 

angelness

sarNie Egg
The idea of marrying many wives, I can't deny that that isn't abusing their power. But, have you ever thought of how it even happened and why did men out of no where start marry multiple wives? People just take what they saw and start doing it for no reasons, just like what the Hmong men are doing nowadays, marrying multiple wives. I believe there has to be a logical reason as to why, not for their satisfaction.

If you do not believe that women abuse their powers more than men, I suggest you look very closely. Also, try to look it from the men's perspective and not just the women and you will see. About the women calling the cops on the guys all the time, it is very true. I used to think it was just Hmong people exaggerating, but it really happens. They will use every little excuse they can find to call the cops on the guys whenever there's an arguement. And you know who the cops will side with? The ladies, because they're so innocent and know how to put up a good show. :rolleyes: But since most of the times the guys never touched the lady, the cops can't do anything but go back. The point here is that they need to show respect to their husbands instead of always trying to walk over them because they think they are more intelligent than the guys and they know that men are not allow to hit women or do anything to them in this country. I'm not trying to say that men should be allow to hit women, but there are better solutions than to always call the cops on their husband. To me, that's like divorcing your husband or treating them like trash where you can throw it out whenever you want.

Another thing Hmong women forget is who they are. They need to understand who they really are and stop denying their cultural beliefs just because we're living in a new country. By the way I'm not saying this because I'm a guy, but from what I am seeing nowadays in today's society involving our Hmong people. B)

What do you mean by 'understanding who they are and stop denying cultural beliefs"? There are a billions different personalities out there in the world... what are you some kind of Expert on how Hmong women should act like? That's just plain wrong... it's like saying all women should all go back to the cave-man days...cooking, cleaning, and taking care of children... *news flash* this is the 21st century... It's not just the country... You men and you're ideology of how women 'should be' and 'should act' is the reason so many women suffers from oppression, suppression, and the injustice done to them since the beginning of time! You don't know the kind of suppressed verbal beatings a women holds in from a guy...building up until she can't take it no more... I'm sure the reason a women would ever call a cop on a guy is that she's finally BRAVE enough to stand-up for herself and be able to live like a human being and not a SLAVE...
People are never grateful for what a women has to go through...Even when a women is in the work-field working a full-time bringing home money, she is always expected to come home and work "another" full-time job as a wife and mother... while the husband, all he do is come home, watch TV and play games... he does so little, yet because he is a MAN, he is seen more... No one ever sees the sacrifice a women makes... your not a women, that's why you can't see that....
 
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